I'm very interested in setting up a chicken self foraging system that produces all their food without need for maintenance. Let this be a place to share knowledge about perennial plants that can be used as chicken fodder and self sustaining chicken foraging systems.

In the book "Omnivores Dilemma" he talks about a rotational grass pasture system where the cows are kept in a paddock surrounded by portable electric fencing. After a fews days of eating the grass in that paddock the cows are moved to a fresh paddock. After 3 days, plump maggots have grown in the cow paddys and the chickens are moved in to eat the maggots and thus eliminate the pests that would otherwise infect the cows (if you wait longer than 3 or 4 days then the maggots turn into adults and fly away). The cows and the chickens fertilize the grass, the cows fertilize the grass and cause the grass to grow back quicker by trimming it (but not cutting it back too short), the flys provide protein to the chickens which eliminate pathogens that would infect the cows, the chickens fertilize the grass which in turn provides nutrients for the cows and the chickens. In this circular system the pastureland becomes better and better each pass through.

I'd like to try a similar system with goats followed by chickens in this way.

I'd also like to plant perennial chicken and goat fodder which requires little to no irrigation and provides all the food the chickens require (and goats too if possible). I live on nearly 1 acre of mostly grassland which I believe is plenty to support sustainable rotational grazing for up to about 6 goats and I'm not sure how many chickens.

Some of the perennial plants that I've found to be good fodder are:
I'm very interested in setting up a chicken self foraging system that produces all their food without need for maintenance. Let this be a place to share knowledge about perennial plants that can be used as chicken fodder and self sustaining chicken foraging systems.

In the book "Omnivores Dilemma" he talks about a rotational grass pasture system where the cows are kept in a paddock surrounded by portable electric fencing. After a fews days of eating the grass in that paddock the cows are moved to a fresh paddock. After 3 days, plump maggots have grown in the cow paddys and the chickens are moved in to eat the maggots and thus eliminate the pests that would otherwise infect the cows (if you wait longer than 3 or 4 days then the maggots turn into adults and fly away). The cows and the chickens fertilize the grass, the cows fertilize the grass and cause the grass to grow back quicker by trimming it (but not cutting it back too short), the flys provide protein to the chickens which eliminate pathogens that would infect the cows, the chickens fertilize the grass which in turn provides nutrients for the cows and the chickens. In this circular system the pastureland becomes better and better each pass through.

I'd like to try a similar system with goats followed by chickens in this way.

I'd also like to plant perennial chicken and goat fodder which requires little to no irrigation and provides all the food the chickens require (and goats too if possible). I live on nearly 1 acre of mostly grassland which I believe is plenty to support sustainable rotational grazing for up to about 6 goats and I'm not sure how many chickens.

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According to the book Permaculture Plants and what I've been able to find online, the following plants are good chicken fodder:
- Acacia aneura (mulga)
very hard wood good for fence posts, 1.4kg daily ration of mulga leaf supplies sheep with sufficient protein, calcium, & vit A
- Acacia baileyana
Fast growing, reasonably drought tolerant, seed is a good poultry feed
- Acacia cuspidifolia (spine-tipped wattle)
moderately fast growing, grows in difficult soils, has potential for fodder as it has strong regrowth after heavy grazing
- Acacia cyclops (coastal wattle)
foliage is fodder for goats
- Acacia victoriae (dundabluey, narran, prickly wattle)
moderate fast growing, leaves are good source of protein for poultry & humans
- Azolla spp
small floating fern perennial, valuagle pig & poultry food
- Albizia lebek (siris tree) & A. lophantha (crested wattle, spiked acacia)
moderately fast growing, high protien fodder, reported that one tree can provide 27% of cows annual feed
- Bactris gasipae (peach palm, pejibaye)
pig & poultry forage
- Cajanus cajan (pigeon pea)
Pigeon pea is an excellent cattle, pig & chicken forage for warmer areas, providing high protein seeds, edible leafy greens and shelter. Nitrogen fixing, drought tolerant shrub.
- Casaurina spp (Australian Sheoak)
Cattle, goats and sheep enjoy the seedlings, suckers and high protein foliage, so weeping varieties are useful. The ground foliage has been used as an ingredient in chicken feed and also has value as a drought fodder.
- Celtis australis (hackberry, nettle tree)
fruits the size and color of an edible green pea, fruits are a good chicken forage (also human edible)
- Ceratonia siliqua (carob)
frost & drought tolerant, seedpods are an excellent cattle & goat fodder, good windbreak & shade, chocolate substitue, can yield up to 400 kilos of seedpods
- Chamaecytisus proliferus (tagasaste, tree lucerne)
prolific producer of seeds which is good source of chicken fodder, leaves are also good chicken fodder
- Cornus capitata (dogwood, thammal)
frost tolerant, fast growing, berries are popular with chickens
- Coprosma repens (coprosma, taupata)
drought & frost tolerant, good windbreak, good fire retarant, berries good poultry fodder, foliage is a good stockfeed
- Cotoneaster spp
Hardy, tolerates minimum care and dry conditions. berries are edible to chickens
- Crataegus oxyacantha (english hawthorn)
berries good poultry feed
- Derris indica (indian beech)
fast growing, foliage is good livestock feed, seed presscake is good poultry feed
- Elaeagnus angustifolia (russian olive, boehmian oliv, oleaster)
berries are good poultry forage
- Eriobotrya japonica (loquat)
moderately drought & wind tolerant, excellent shade protection, has potential as animal forage
- Eugenia spp (lillipillis)
bears large quantities of fruit over a long perios, likely good pig and poultry food
- Fagus sylvatica (common beech, european beech)
fruit is very good pig & poultry feed, foliage is good animal forage
- Ficus spp (such as fig)
fruits are good poultry feed
- Gleditsia triacanthos (honey locust)
drought tolerant, pods are good forage for pigs, sheep, cattle and goats, nutrional quality said to be superior to oats as stock feed, pods can be used for human food & alcohol fuel production, good furniture timber
- Lespedez bicolor (miracle plant)
nitrogen fixing, high protein stock feed, good poultry feed, high quality firewood
- Lucumo obovata (lucuma)
Single tree can produce up to 500 fruit per year (human edible), fruit falls to ground when ready and is a valuable chicken forage
- Morus spp (mulberry)
drought resistant, easily propagated, shade tolerant, heavy fruit bearers, fruit is good pig and chicken forage, leaves can be used for livestock feed, timber good for tool handles & fence posts
- Orbignya oleifera
potential forage for pigs & poultry
- Phoenix dactylifera (date palm), Phoenix sylvestris (wild date palm) & Phoenix zeylandica
dates are human edible, can be tapped for sugar, seeds good chicken forage, after soaking the seeds are a good livestock feed
- Populus euphratica (euphrates poplar)
drought & heat tolerant, fast growing, foliage is extremely nutritious stock feed
- Psidium cattleianum (strawberry guava, cherry guava)
fruit is great human food, windbreak, poultry forage
- Robinia pseudoacacia (black locust)
fast growing, nitrogen fixing, foliage good livestock fodder, seed good poultry feed, hard timber good for fend posts
- Salix spp (willow)
use lots of water, very fast growing, many varieties have foliage that is edible to livestock
- Wolffia spp (duckweed)
one of the most vigorously growing plants, good fish, duck & domestic animal fodder, human edible
- Ziphus mauritiana (indian jujube)
withstands sever heat, drought, & frost. human edible frout, leaves edible after cooking, foliage good fodder for cattle & goats
- Ziziphus spina (christ thorn)
heat & drought tolerant, fruits human edible & fodder for sheep & goats

Great info, thanks SM!

Here's a snippet from that link:

I think goats might eat your grass all the way down to the ground. Goats will also eat the bark off most fruit trees or any other smooth barked tree thus killing the tree. Just something to consider.

Thanks a lot compass, I'm planning some chickens this spring and would like to do plantings for feed. I've printed the list. Some of those won't work here as its too cold. I already have a mulberry planted, and I'm going to transplant another into the chicken area. I plan on moving the chickens around to graze them but they will have one main "yard" about 25 by 100 or maybe more where I plan on planting shrubs/trees.

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"Meet the New Boss...Same as the old Boss" The Who

Yay, a chicken thread!

My chickens love to eat the mustard greens and the fava bean plants that we grow over the winter here as a cover crop. I didn't think that they were eating the favas and had planned to harvest the seed to roast and grind into their scratch, but it looks like they are in fact nibbling on the ends of the buds, so we may not have much of a crop. After initially buying seeds and planting the mustard and fava, they naturalized and had always re-seeded themselves (with a bit of help from us collecting some seed). But since the chickens are so good at eating the terminal buds, we might not get much seed this year and may have to buy some. Solution would be to have a chicken-free area for a seed crop, but we're still figuring this out.

And of course, they just love the black oil sunflower seeds (BOSS), so we're going to grow a bunch of them. I've read on other forums that the BOSS you get in big bags as bird seed is unroasted and fertile, so I'm going to try growing that.

And feeding off Saul's link (if you will), black soldier flies are another excellent source of insect protein for your chooks. Here's a good blog on the subject, http://blacksoldierflyblog.com/ and a video from the same site:

__________________

"What would you attempt to do if you knew you could not fail?" - Inspirational quote by Dr. Robert Schuller
Bankster version: "What loans would you write if you knew you were too big to be allowed to fail?"

Chickens are cheep insurance. Raise a flock of chickens in your backyard! This is a good starting place:
http://www.backyardchickens.com/

Favas, mustard and sunflower seeds all grow fine here. Since we're getting chickes I want to try and grow as much food as I can. Found this on the following link: http://permaculture.info/index.php/T...n_forage_guild

Early summer forage guild (planted fall)
In dry summer areas, it is difficult to plant seed following early summer forage, so replanting will either require irrigation or be delayed until fall.
Rye shoots
comfrey
mustard family greens
fava beans (Vicea faba)
overwintering peas
dandelion (Taraxacum officinale)
plantain (Plantago spp.))
chickweed

Late summer/Fall forage (planted in spring)
lambs quarters
dock (Rumex spp.)
sunflowers (Helianthus spp.)
Siberian pea shrub (Caragana spp.)
Wheat, Rye, Barley, Oats, Amaranth, Quinoa or other grains.
[edit] Winter forage (planted spring)
kale and other overwintering mustards
corn salad
sunflowers (Helianthus)

Medicinals
For additional ideas look at The Complete Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable
Feverfew (
Wormwood (Artemesia absinthe)
Rue (Ruta graveolens)

Potential Relationship
Chicken forage guilds can be grown amongst small fruits and orchards that benefit from fertilization.
Trees that produce fence poles can be grown for shade.
Seed for chicken forage guilds can be produced in annual gardens
Chicken tractors can be used to prepare ground for planting chicken gui

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"Meet the New Boss...Same as the old Boss" The Who

Most of the goats I have owned would rarely eat pasture grass! They eat everything else! Weeds, thorny stuff, flowers, paper, string, cigarettes are their favorites!

When an animal eats bark, it means that it is lacking minerals. We feed Sea Kelp to our animals. Sea Kelp also increases milk production by 25%. You can get it in 50 lb bags from a company in Maine. ( I cant remember the name right now)

Maybe they'll eat some comfrey (Symphytum officinale) / (Symphytum x uplandicum)??

chicken fodder...
http://permaculturetokyo.blogspot.co...h-comfrey.html

http://www.owenfoundation.com/cgi-bi...es%3Bread=4911

http://www.motherearthnews.com/Organ...ey.aspx?page=4

http://livingthefrugallife.blogspot....der-plant.html



http://books.google.com/books?id=CbN...um=4#PPA221,M1


http://forum.backyardpoultry.com/vie...f=11&t=7968168

http://ahualoa.net/chickens/

http://www.irishseedsavers.ie/article.php?artid=61

http://lindsaywolsey.com/DRCCW/100hs...officinale.htm

Turkeys seem to love comfrey according to one farmer...
http://thedeliberateagrarian.blogspo...ey-update.html

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"On and for the record, I do not give you my consent to alter, strike or dismiss my counterclaim.
You have exhausted your administrative remedy.
You are now in default.
Who do I see to get paid?" --Tim Turner

tagasaste

http://www.greenharvest.com.au/seeds...ry_forage.html

http://books.google.com/books?id=40n...esult&resnum=4

http://scarecrowsgarden.blogspot.com...der-plant.html

__________________
Paper is a promise for a fool

"On and for the record, I do not give you my consent to alter, strike or dismiss my counterclaim.
You have exhausted your administrative remedy.
You are now in default.
Who do I see to get paid?" --Tim Turner

Good stuff, people...

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"Adequate capital eliminates the need for an unachievable specificity in regulatory fine-tuning."
Greenspan

our 10 to 15 chickens turned a 1/4 acre of thick weeds to dirt in about 10 weeks.....
nothing grows there anymore

__________________
Bye GIMmers

Its been a Fun learning experience !

Black oil sunflower seeds are indeed fertile. I've got them coming up thick in several places around the garden.

I only got around to fencing about half of our garden, but so far chicken damage to the corn and squash sprouts is minimal. I'm too cheap to fence this particular part of the garden, so we'll see how much the chickens leave for us.

__________________

"What would you attempt to do if you knew you could not fail?" - Inspirational quote by Dr. Robert Schuller
Bankster version: "What loans would you write if you knew you were too big to be allowed to fail?"

Chickens are cheep insurance. Raise a flock of chickens in your backyard! This is a good starting place:
http://www.backyardchickens.com/

Compass,
My folks have goats and i haven't really noticed much flys in the poop. perhaps they are dense little pellets and the flys can't stick their young'ns in them? (or mebbee i'm just not looking hard enough...)

Traderken,
are you saying that the area that they are permanently in is dirt, or that you have moved the coop, and the spot they were previously in is dead ground permanently? it makes sense that the patch they are on turns to dirt pdq, but it would seem odd that the chicken crap wouldn't fertilize the ground well for once they are off it since they sell organic fertalizer based on the stuff...

__________________
"Ye have locked yourselves up in cages of fear -- and behold, do ye now complain that ye lack FREEDOM! -- Epistle to the Paranoids, 1:1"
Please note that in any argument that I am involved, I am less interested in proving that I am right, than proving that you, quite possibly, are wrong.
I was certified as a Paid Govt. Shill by my score in the GIM Aptitude Test (Score: OVER 9000!!!1!!)
Freedom is a verb

well they are still in the 50X70ft area
nothing grows there Mainly (i guess) because the minute something sprouted they would eat it.
And Chickens "Scratch" alot

I suppose if we moved them, The weeds might come back.

Although I know that their poop is strong stuff and would probably kill most young plants.

Im still new at this so I don't know alot bout it...

just sayin...

__________________
Bye GIMmers

Its been a Fun learning experience !

No!

Maybe you are confusing goats with sheep. Cattle graze on pasture grass. They tear it down as low as their teeth can grip. Cattle ranchers got angry with sheep because they can tear the grass down even lower. So low that the cattle can't graze on it again for quite some time. Goats, on the other hand, eat like deer. They are foragers. They don't put their head down and just graze in a straight line on grass. They use their eyes to notice anything in a field that is "different." They zoom in on it and eat it. If you put goats out in a grass pasture with lots of weeds, they will move around eating every weed they can find. A goat pasture ends up more weed free than your average lawn!

And cattle and sheep don't eat browse. Goats love to eat shrubs and the tips of trees. I've got hundreds of trees out in my goat pasture and I don't have a single adult tree that has ever been killed by them. They ARE hell on immature small trees. You can't plant a three foot sapling out in a goat pasture. It will be a short stick before you know it!

As somebody else said, goat poop doesn't attract flies. It is hard little balls and they are scattered far and wide. Cattle dung is very wet and they stand in one place and just dump out a gallon or two of it at once. (The famous cow patties.)

I've read Michael's book as well and it is one that I would highly recommend to anybody with land and livestock. The OP is actually referring to a section where Michael went and lived with Joel on his farm. Joel himself has written numerous books.

Gregg

__________________
WHEN INJUSTICE BECOMES LAW RESISTANCE BECOMES DUTY

Treat me good and I’ll treat you better...Treat me bad and I’ll treat you worse.
Hell's Angel 1969

pH is too low since chicken shit is acidic. The lime will raise the pH.

__________________
No gods or kings, only Man.

__________________
WHEN INJUSTICE BECOMES LAW RESISTANCE BECOMES DUTY

Treat me good and I’ll treat you better...Treat me bad and I’ll treat you worse.
Hell's Angel 1969

Lime..ok thanks I will try that.

Thanks Bwel

__________________
Bye GIMmers

Its been a Fun learning experience !

Bump. Curious how any of you are doing nearly a year later with your forage systems?

Saxon's fly idea is interesting, but maybe challenging on a smaller scale. There are plenty of other things that larvae will grow on besides human feces.

Know one fellow who lets avocados go wormy and chickens go crazy for them. Fallen fruit is built into the permaculture system, by setting some fruits aside for a few days you end up with a value added product.

Sweet potato vines & leaves make nutritious fodder for cattle, sheep, goats. The leaves are quite tasty and fit for human consumption. The vines are sweet as well, but older vines are a bit fibrous for humans. Let your livestock eat the vines and you eat the tubers.

As for perennial forage plants, many of them can be planted on one side of a fence so shoots peek through or over a fence, but will never be fully destroyed by those miniature feathered velociraptors.

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-Chief Charles Chipps
- Bill Mollison

chicken like bugs, so any environment that attracts bugs will be chicken friendly. e.g. putting pieces of wood on the ground for the bugs to build their homes, then lifting up the pieces of wood at feeding time (for the chickens).

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LASIK-FLAP.com Website Created by Group of Injured LASIK Patients

Good plan.
Maybe try this too- if you are going to have a light source in your coop, instead of sticking it up on the ceiling, attach it to a cord or rope etc. so that you can lower it down to a foot or so off the ground for a while in the evening and let your chickens gorge themsleves on the moths and other bugs attracted to the light. Put a protective caging around the bulb.

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Quandocumque impellunt, repelle.

Was reading some eat the weeds info on purslane, noting its omega 3 content and thought maybe good for chickens... a search turned up this:

www.MicroEcoFarming.com

__________________
-Chief Charles Chipps
- Bill Mollison

My wife grew up on a farm. Some of the local farmers would chain a pygmy goat or sheep to a big old tire on a rim and move the tire daily to change the animal's pasture area. Cheaper than fences.
I wonder how kudzu would fare in a war with goats...

I think if you are truly going to let your chickens roam free range you have to be prepared for a high loss rate due to predation. Just something to think about with the type of system the OP mentions.

Goats win...

__________________
" Liberty, the greatest of all earthly blessings — give us that precious jewel, and you may take every thing else! Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel." ~ Patrick Henry

I picked up 1lb of dried pigeon pea in the latin section of Publix supermarket for $1.39 - Goya Brand. I'll see if they sprout and start experimenting with them. Don't have any chickens (yet), but pigeon peas are quite delicious for humans, too. Won't tolerate more than a light frost, but down here in S. Florida they should grow into nice little trees that produce for 3-5 years. We get enough rain, they won't need to be irrigated at all (they grow well in dry climates, too) and should be able to reseed themselves easily. With a pound of beans being this cheap, I may do a little guerilla gardening in some nearby semi-wild lots.

__________________
-Chief Charles Chipps
- Bill Mollison

Based on my experience with exotic pets I think you would have your best chance farming earthworms and/or crickets to supplement allowing your chickens to graze. A bird as large as a chicken is going to need to eat a lot of worms and bugs so go big on your worm and cricket farms. The good news is that the invertebrates are stackable. Composting worms live in only the top few inches of their bedding and crickets don't need much space either. 6 inch high beds in a rack system would allow you to raise a lot of high protein bird food on abundant material birds normally can't eat, like junk mail and dryer lint.